Hello Again,

I manage to answer some of my answers just by looking in the forum

1) Because i once overstayed can that affect my application, the HO are aware of the situation  cause i had to go home to sort things out..

2) I found the questions for the test thanks

Please reply to question (3)

What is your country of origin?

Someone may well correct me, but it's my understanding that the British authorities, being perfectly happy with dual citizenship, do not go out of their way to inform another country that you've taken on UK nationality (though they do warn you on the application that it could well affect your situation with your native country). 

In my country (the US), there is a question on the passport-renewal application that asks whether you've ever sworn an oath to a foreign country or been naturalised in a foreign country.  The US does allow dual nationality; but when you answer 'yes' to those questions, the authorities *do* want to know for certain whether you intended to keep your US nationlity -- so, when/if I am allowed to take British citizenship, I *will* be queried, under penalty of perjury, as soon as my US passport expires and I have to get another one. 

This is the kind of thing you might want to be aware of.  I don't know what the specific laws are in your country -- nor how well they're enforced in reality.  (Both of those things have bearing.)  But you'd be well-advised to check before you take British citizenship -- just so you know what the facts are.

you are very kind  William Ingle-Gillis  I am from Botswana my passport is only 2 years old, Its  honestly hard to get an ID and passport in Botswana . I do want the British passport since my husband and 2kids have them and its strange when we go on holiday its like we are not together. But giving up my passport its like selling my soul. Whats the worse that could happen if i keep them??? Will i be arrested?

Everyone,

Can someone please answer my other question

Because i overstayed at one point will that affect my naturalisation application????

Emma --

If you're from Botswana -- a Commonwealth country -- and you already have Indefinite Leave to Remain, you may want to consider carefully how advantageous or otherwise it will be for you to have British citizenship. Within the UK, a Commonwealth citizen with ILR will have most, if not all, the same rights and privileges as a British citizen: the right to vote, for example, or stand for election to public office. (By contrast, as an American [non-Commonwealth], even with ILR, I cannot vote or stand for office -- so I would need British citizenship, in a way that you might not, in order to participate fully in British life.)

The biggest disadvantage, as you have already mentioned, is in travel: it's easier to travel to many countries on a British passport than on a Botswanan passport, and easier in the practical sense that your family can go through the same queue.

If Botswana put their passport applications online, you might have a look to see what questions are asked, as I suspect that's where they'd be most likely to catch you out. (It also should go without saying that you should *always* enter Botswana on a Botswanan passport.)  As for 'what's the worst that can happen'?  You'd have to check into the Botswanan laws -- and the extent to which they're enforced.  I think it'd be most likely that you'd be stripped forcibly of your citizenship if they found out; but -- as a pure blind guess -- I wouldn't think it was a criminal offence. 

As for the over-stay, it would be helpful for you to explain the circumstances. I suspect that P Pron would be a treasure-trove of info if he knows more about it.

If your over-stay was more than 3 years ago (since you're married to a British citizen) -- or 5 for anyone else -- I don't think they'll ask about that on the application; but they'll surely have a record of it already (and they'll have it on hand) when they look at your naturalisation application. If your over-stay was under 2 years ago, then in theory they shouldn't have granted you ILR yet, anyway, as ILR (for spouses of Brits or settled persons) requires 2 years of prior legal residence. Whatever the case, if I were you, I would let 3 years pass from your last *legal* entry into the UK before making the application, as the application (as I understand it) requires you to have been present *legally* for 3 years (as the spouse of a Brit) and 5 years (if not a spouse of a Brit). It also requires that you should have been **physically present** -- not even away on holiday -- on the exact date 3/5 years before the Home Office receive your application. (So if you were on holiday for a week this time 3 years ago, wait a week to send in your app.)

Hope some of this helps.

Emma -- here are two links which may help you: 

The first is the relevant section of the Botswanan constitution on citizenship. 
The second includes a news article (2002) on a public figure who came to light as a dual citizen (of Botswana and S. Africa), and commentary from other public types on the situation.  This may give you a flavour of how British nationality would impact upon your situation.  That second one is very long and contains lots of articles -- you have to scroll down pretty far to get to the one you're looking for. 












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http://www.unhcr.org/cgi-bin/texis/vtx/rsd/rsddocview.html?tbl=RSDLEGAL&id=3ae6b4d88

http://www.queensu.ca/samp/migrationnews/2002/may/1.htm

FYI -- I found these by a simple Google search on 'Botswana' and ' "dual citizenship" '.  You may wish to do the same, as it fed back many pages, some with very good information. 

The physical presence of 3 year / 5 year rule applies on the date of application or date when the home office receives your application?

I think its the date when you are submitting your application either at a NCS or by post. The difference could be because a case worker may not look at your application for a week / month on which date you might have been actually out of the country.

P Pron / Mrs G / Waheed , whats your thoughts?

When I applied for ILR they kept their record with the Number on the Recorded Delivery and the Date Stamp by the post office and not when they received it or case worker looked at it. 

Be on the safe side and wait an extra week.

The instructions specifically state (p. 19):  "NB You should also check that you were physically present in the United Kingdom 5 years (3 years if you are married to a British citizen) before the date that the application will be received by the Immigration and Nationality Directorate or other receiving authority." 

Quite unambiguous, actually.  🙂 

As already stated, they keep a record of when these things are received (and usually signed for), so no one need look at the application, per se, just as long as someone's there to make a note of the delivery. 

Of course, if you want to play it safe, there's only a day between posting time and arrival time, usually -- which is not terribly long to wait.  If you want the postmark to be 5 years to the day, it'll only delay your app by 24 hours.  :)

Just to confirm:

• when you are making an Immigration application - eg for ILR, FLR, etc, the important date is the date on which the application is SENT
• when you are making Nationality application, the important date is the date on which the Home Office RECEIVES the application. The "other receiving authority" mentioned in William's quote includes British Embassies, High Commissions overseas, but I don't think it includes NCS offices.

William is right to emphasise the point that only legal presence in the UK counts towards the qualifying period for naturalisation - so any period as an overstayer must be before the start of the three year/five year residence period. Other than that, I doubt that overstaying prior to the residence period would be held against you; the time to deal with that would have been at the time they made the decision as to whether to give you ILR - if they wanted to "punish" you for it, it seems to me that they could have done that by delaying your getting ILR. That's just my view, though!!

paul

The sites you posted were really really helpful. You made a good point about being in the commonwealth, my husband want us to have the option to go back if we want to anytime and not struggle applying to return residency. Things are too complicated in my homeland things still have to go through the chief (and I mean the village chief) to get things started to get an ID, they are the first contact if they haven?t seen you for ages or cant remember you then you are in deep trouble. Based on this evidence I think I will keep my passport, WELLLL I will give it a year and I will make my final decision. But have a read at this

"If we become aware of dual citizenship, we immediately take away that of Botswana. For example, one cannot be a Motswana and a Namibian all at the same time,? he said. According to Sebele the exception is when one attains citizenship of another country through marriage, which he said is a different matter.But Pilane says that is a ?fallacy?. While conceding that he was a citizen of both Botswana and South Africa at the time of his appointment, Pilane is adamant that there was nothing wrong in holding dual citizenship. ?So far as I am concerned, the debate concerning my citizenship is a discussion in which I have not participated and am not prepared to participate because in it results from witch?hunt. I have always been a citizen of Botswana and at no time have I lost that citizenship,? he said. In an interview with The Gazette, Pilane maintained he never acted against the laws of Botswana and as such never lost the protection of his citizenship through those same laws. He said even when he was working in South Africa a few years ago he never renounced his Botswana citizenship, a view Sebele rejected. ?If its true Pilane knew what the law said when he went to South Africa, but still went ahead and attained South African citizenship, then he was prepared to risk his Botswana citizenship because had we known, the Minister would have invoked his powers and deprived him of the Botswana citizenship. We do not allow dual citizenship in Botswana under any circumstances,? he said. He, however, conceded there is a loophole in the Citizenship Act which some people have exploited to attain dual citizenship. This happens in the case where a citizen of Botswana goes to another country and gets citizenship of that country without notifying the authorities in Botswana. ?I do not agree that it is a loophole. It is law and we cannot interpret it on the basis of what some one supposes it should be,? Pilane said. The Ministry is working on tightening the law to fully eliminate all chances of Batswana over 21 years from holding citizenship of other countries at the same time. The Citizenship Act of 1998 says ?Any person who is a citizen of Botswana and also a citizen of another country shall upon the attainment of the age of 21 years cease to be a citizen of Botswana unless such a person has immediately before the attainment of the age of 21 years renounced the citizenship of that other country, taken the full oath of allegiance, and made such declaration of intentions concerning residence as may be prescribed"

So in other words it can be done!!!!!I looked at the form they use when your passport has expired and its so straigh forward its unreal, maybe because we have always had ID's with fingerprints so they could easily check you out. Its just one page doesnt saying anything about taking residency in another country

Given your comment about 'option to go back', there's one other point you should probably bear in mind: 

ILR continues only for as long as you actually remain in the UK.  To be more specific:  whilst you live here, you will always have permanent residence and no longer need to apply for visas.  **However**, if you leave the UK -- say you go to live in Botswana for a time -- your ILR will expire after two years.  Thus, you can return as a permanent resident *within those two years*; but should you remain in Botswana, say, for three years, then you'd have to apply again for re-entry, then remain for two years on limited leave to remain, before re-applying for ILR.

Also -- as a side note -- ILR is only useful for residence in Britain.  Whilst Commonwealth citizens living here have all the same rights as Brits, they do *not* have the right to go live in another EU country in the same way that Brits do. So if you ever wanted to move to Spain, then a British passport would by far be better for that. 

Just more food for thought whilst you're waiting out your third year. 

Hello everyone I'm a new girl how are you all doing???

Quick questions.. Can someone be refused Nuturalisation??? eg If you have been married over3 years, have ILR and passed the test.

2) Is there anyway i can get the questions on the internet/ the forum without buying the book??

3) In my country Dual citizen is not permitted how will my country know that i have nuturalised if i dont tell them???